Episode Transcript
Speaker 1 00:00:17 Hello and welcome to this special edition of the Fremantle press podcast. My name is Helen Milroy and I really love kids books. I'm also an author and illustrator. I love hosting this podcast because we get to talk to some really fabulous and interesting people about their books. And I have someone especially important today. In fact, it's someone who's been quite an inspiration to me throughout my life. So today I'd like to welcome along to our podcast. Gladys Milroy. Now Gladys mirror also happens to be my mum. Now, Gladys is an elder of the Palka people of the Pilbara region of Western Australia throughout her life. Glen has always been a strong advocate for improving the wellbeing of Aboriginal people and believes that family culture and land are central to this. As part of the stolen generations, glad spent most of her childhood years in the park of an orphanage, however, was able to maintain a very strong connection with her mother Daisy and together. They raised Glad's five children of which I was the youngest dad has had a very successful and varied career. She has owned and run businesses, managed art galleries and festivals, and is an artist, author and illustrator. She's a highly regarded speaker and educator regarding cultural issues and has been actively involved for many years in the non native title claim for our Palka mob up in the Pilbara. Now in her nineties, Glen is still writing stories, advocating for land rights and supporting family. Welcome to today's podcast. Mum.
Speaker 2 00:01:46 Thanks Helen. It's a pleasure to be here. So mom, tell us a little bit about yourself first. I guess I grew myself up because I was taken away and putting it off in age the age of two years old. So I was there for about 14 years. So that was my childhood big in the north village.
Speaker 1 00:02:05 Do you remember any books growing up and if so, was there one that really stuck out for you?
Speaker 2 00:02:11 Well, I guess the education was a very good, so once I did learn three, I was absolutely in my element. I just loved books, but the trouble was, there were a few books that we had to read. There was no library, anything like that, only a few odds and ends that were donated by people, mostly magazines for kids books or something. I guess my favorite book in the whole area, there was, um, a cake book, a cookbook, a cake book that was full of gorgeous cakes. That was my favorite book for a while, till I was older. Of course, in that all Speiser was Anne of green Gables, but, um, I still love cakes.
Speaker 1 00:02:53 So why did Anne of green Gables have a special place for you?
Speaker 2 00:02:57 I don't know. Maybe it was a sort of life are visualized having, I would like to have had, so I was very much probably envious I suppose, because my life wasn't anything like that. How
Speaker 1 00:03:10 Did you first become interested maybe at what age did you start thinking about your own stories?
Speaker 2 00:03:17 Well, I think the thing is about growing up in an orphanage that you live in a little story all the time, because that's the way you survive. Oh, hell I had to have stories. I wouldn't have survived. And so there was somehow this make believe. Well, I remember it was a dog at the orphanage. Well imagine all these kids wanted to pet the dog. That was one dog. Um, I never got to pet it, but I always wanted a dog when I was walking to school and also this rock in the Bush and it just looked like a dog and I thought, oh, you know, so everybody, where do I go to school? I'd call up. Hello dog in the morning. And then one morning I was rushing to school and I've got to say hello. And I heard this dog barking. And so I had Nick back, gave him a pet and went to school the third on a Sunday when we were allowed to go in the Bush, I'd go and sit with the dog. So anyhow Winton thought, oh, make him a little garden out the front. So I smiled a little garden from even found the old bone in the Bush and I'll sit next to the dog. And we were facing the sun and the dog was nice and warm. So it was, you know, like I had this real dog, I suppose that was the first time I had the idea of having this little world of by own. That's probably influenced me later with story writing.
Speaker 1 00:04:47 So mom you've told me sometimes about how your stories come to you. Would you like to tell our listeners how you get the stories?
Speaker 2 00:04:55 A lot of his stories are good at night when I'm dreaming. I often dream a story or sometimes I'll just be outside. I might just see something, maybe something in the guard don't know something about that. And it just sits or some sort of, it's not actually a memory, but it's like a story. When I get a story it's like all in color and I'm part of it and I'm in a story and that's what I love about it. It's like I'm in this beautiful story that I brought in the seventies. The
Speaker 1 00:05:24 Idea of you being in the story when you get it, is that a bit like when you were a kid and had that sense?
Speaker 2 00:05:30 Well, I think so. It's like I'm watching a movie, but I'm part of it. And not only that, a lot more stories, I just cry. I cry at the site. I get very moved by my own stories, which I don't know if everybody gets locked that, but I do when the store is happy, I'm happy. And when, when it's not happy sitting at the desk, well, really, so there's a lot of emotion in the stories and feel the emotion that maybe that's why I feel part of it so much.
Speaker 1 00:06:01 So with the dreaming, how does that work? Do you wake up with a fully formed story in the morning or do you have a series of
Speaker 2 00:06:07 Dreams? I feel that sport, the Aboriginal side of beef, because all I've done have all people come to me, see my mom, then the stories are remembered because when we found our family, the big thing was you went up there and RDL, she, she have a big barbecue. Everybody would tear it up. Somehow everybody knew we were humming after the barbecue. Everybody we'd sit there. And there was a war as a storyteller and exit. I had two uncles who were both storytellers and both were quite, you know, you still argue with each other who was the best. And I think it's an Aboriginal thing and I'm sure there's probably Aboriginal people that have that sort of thing. But there were always stories. We were in our old community and there were always stories there.
Speaker 1 00:06:58 So some of the stories come from your ancestors.
Speaker 2 00:07:00 Yes. But they're not their stories on telling them. Sometimes it's almost as if I've been told to write about something, especially when it's your environment being effected with the morning. You know, I've always felt like growing up with trees where my family always felt safe and loved if I was sitting under a tree or near a tree, because going back into the house where we lived, wasn't safe.
Speaker 1 00:07:29 So your safe place was in the Bush, kind of a safe
Speaker 2 00:07:32 Choice in the Bush.
Speaker 1 00:07:34 I guess one of the hallmarks of, uh, indigenous or Aboriginal storytelling is that everything is connected. And so stories about connection to land or animals are really prominent in these sorts of stories.
Speaker 2 00:07:48 Well, I, I was felt I could talk to them. I remember there was a wheat field that we were never allowed to go into, but one of the kids had cut a hole in the Bible I fence. And there was nothing as beautiful as lying in a field of wheat. And it was so high and, and it was all the, all the fruit was on there, the wheat and just looking up at the sky. And, uh, I used to have this little gray Wallaby used to sit with me and, um, she was beautiful. She, she had a, she had a beautiful face, just like a mother and we would we'd sit and talk. So I guess maybe that wasn't real, but it was very real to me.
Speaker 1 00:08:35 So being in nature was like being with family bit.
Speaker 2 00:08:38 Yeah, that's right. Feet with the age. It was hot. That
Speaker 1 00:08:43 How long did it take you to write a story? If you got that inspiration or you got that dream, how long would it take? Well, I
Speaker 2 00:08:49 Don't know. It doesn't leave me alone. I've just simply got to sit there and do it because it follows me and it adds more or tubs. So, and sometimes the endings quite hard and I don't get the ending and I've got a white and white and white until I've got that proper ending. Sometimes I can write it in a di uh, the time it might take weeks, you know, I, I wrote a novel reason. I had, it took me at three years. You
Speaker 1 00:09:19 Were involved sometime ago in writing some little story readers for younger children. What were you hoping that the kids would get out of those books,
Speaker 2 00:09:28 Children? They're the ones that have got to take care of their environment. We're leaving it to our children to solve it. I just think we've missed the boat. And now it's up to the kids to repair the damage.
Speaker 1 00:09:43 And you think they'll get that from some of the,
Speaker 2 00:09:45 So they start young enough and they taught the right lesson that we all live together. We're all part of each other. We will be longed to each other. We don't belong to big buildings. We don't belong to television. We belong to NYCHA. We're all part of nature.
Speaker 1 00:10:04 So with your illustrating, you said that sometimes you only do a single illustration.
Speaker 2 00:10:09 I almost write the whole story in the illustration. So, so they hear stories about, uh, uh, Dingo or something like that. I don't just draw a Dingo. I almost draw the whole story that are frequent. I'll just do one big picture. Then it bodies the whole story in a way that seems to be the why I do it. I found it hard just to draw a little bits.
Speaker 1 00:10:32 So there's way of reading the story through the words. And then a second way of reading the story through the picture.
Speaker 2 00:10:38 Well, I think often when you read a book, you skip through a lot of it and you have to read it again to really learn from it. I suppose, by doing the illustration, I almost read the story trust and get the message.
Speaker 1 00:10:53 You've done a lot of things in your career. Many things actually I'm impressed. But do you think your love of storytelling has always been there throughout whatever you've done?
Speaker 2 00:11:04 You know, sometimes I feel like I've had about six different lives. Every life has a different story. Even now out into my old age, this is a different life again now. And I'm getting more stories now than I did years ago, I think because I'm not making memories anymore, but I'm writing stories, which is so strange. The memories I've got narrow all my past life, but the stories I think for the future, because I'm so worried about what's happening in the world. And, um, and I'm also, I suppose, where for our rice, as an Aboriginal, as Aboriginal people, where very, very small percentage of Australia got relationship. So
Speaker 1 00:11:56 I guess what I can take from some of that is that you're never too old to keep writing stories.
Speaker 2 00:12:01 Yeah. You're never too old and you never to enjoy it. A lot of stories. I mean, I, must've written a bit 40 stories. They're not for publication my stories because I enjoy them. Some of them are stories just from our family because it personal, uh, some of them you simply are just don't want to publish, publish soup. You know, I don't do it for, I think I'm going to be fine with somebody got a little muddy out of it's because it's something I enjoy doing,
Speaker 1 00:12:30 But you sometimes also get stories for people. Is that right? And you wrote a story for me, a story for you. You did.
Speaker 2 00:12:40 I know I got a story for you, but you won't let me publish it. I want to, because that's your story and I'll, I'll read the story for all your kids, but I don't want you, I don't want to be published there. Your personal, personal story.
Speaker 1 00:12:55 You said you have a lot of emotion that goes into your stories. Um, how does, how do you come out of the end of that? Is that something that keeps you going, or is it a little bit of a burden? How do you cope with those emotions when you're writing your stories?
Speaker 2 00:13:09 I find it very hard when it's a sad ending. I find I grieve about it for a while. It's not with memories. You know, I got a lot of memories. You can't control memory, and it's like, you know, you have these happy memories, but you've always got those memories. Creepy gave him the bad memory. He said that tight guy. And, and so sort of like that, it's trying to remember all the happy things and not let those bad memories intrude. And I think when you're writing books too, that you have to, you know, there always has to be an ending, but there's always two sorts through a story. Sometimes it can be really happy and sometimes it can be really sad, but then that's lovely.
Speaker 1 00:13:55 Do you think having those emotions with the stories helps you to express your emotions a bit more freely? The
Speaker 2 00:14:01 Nights he was writing, it got to be true. You can't have all this happiness lost. Not that it's not real. It's very hard in children's books to not have that sadness in, but it is life. It is part of life.
Speaker 1 00:14:19 What are you currently working on?
Speaker 2 00:14:21 I've been writing a lot of stories about trees, or actually I'm going to sit and run in here. I don't know her hair look. Okay.
Speaker 3 00:14:29 Good luck. Good luck.
Speaker 2 00:14:32 Um, I feel like, you know how the eldest comes to me sometimes I feel that's what trees do too. And I have to tell is three, until what's happening in Nigeria, everything has a song. Trees have a song and they're not singing that song so much anymore because the birds aren't there. And I'll think that's very important because if we lose it, lose the song of our land, what's there. No bill will be singing anymore.
Speaker 1 00:15:11 What would you like to tell the audience about the importance of stories and storytelling for children? I think
Speaker 2 00:15:17 People have to be very honest and truthful with their kids. Don't dress it up and fancy it up. They need to see the truth, the stories that are locked to ride, uh, giving children some sense. Maybe I hope of what the world should be the world, whereas there's honesty and truthfulness and love, especially love of all things that living.
Speaker 1 00:15:51 Yeah. Have you got any tips for budding writers and illustrators?
Speaker 2 00:15:56 Oh, I think dreamy dreams. And uh, if you've got a story, write it. I found that writing was the best healing I ever had.
Speaker 1 00:16:09 So my, the question was going to be, what is the best thing for you personally? You've partly answered that, but if you had to pick something that you've really benefited out of your life from all the stories that you've written over it B
Speaker 2 00:16:22 It's given me a new lease of life. I've enjoyed it. I love the stories. Sometimes I go back and read them and the poetry. I still get a lot of enjoyment out of it. So I don't know. Maybe it's just giving me the happiness,
Speaker 1 00:16:37 Any final words for our audience today,
Speaker 2 00:16:41 Be happy or not children to grow up in a wonderful world of they're making because they've been taught. The truth does come to love. Country love being children. They've had that lovely environment, not learning just from books, but happy having a happy family. So I'm hoping that what children grow up with is happiness and caring for others.
Speaker 1 00:17:14 Listeners. You've been hearing about the wonderful world of stories according to Gladys. Miroy my mum. If you'd like to read one of flatter stories, then Eagle, Crow and EMU is published by Fremantle press and it's available through all good book stores or online at Fremantle, press.com.edu. If you enjoyed our chat today, subscribe to the Fremantle press podcast on apple podcasts, Google play, SoundCloud, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. My name is Helen <inaudible> and I have been your host today. Join me next time as we continue our journey into everything books. Thanks. Ma'am
Speaker 0 00:17:51 Thanks, Helen. <inaudible>.
